dimanche 15 août 2010

Proposals for the Top 10 Contemporary Classics (1990/2010)



A Chinese magazine – of all things – has asked me to compile a list of the top ten classics of the past two decades. Which led me to ask myself what criteria a contemporary fragrance should fulfill to achieve such a status. These are the three I came up with:


1) Originality: To create new forms or to renew a classic form in such a way that it finds a second life.


2) Fertility: To inspire a perfume family and/or enough imitations for this new form to cross over into our olfactory vocabulary.


3) Popularity: To be bought by enough people for the product to produce durable identification with it. In other words: it needs to sell enough to cross over into our social vocabulary.


This means that no niche perfume can make the cut. Off the top of my head, I can only think of two niche fragrances that are iconic, at least on the French market: L’Artisan Parfumeur Mûre et Musc and Annick Goutal L’Eau d’Hadrien. But both pre-date 1990 so couldn’t make it to the list, and besides, I’m not quite sure they are as popular abroad as they are in France. Big brands are the only ones with enough clout and lasting power to ensure that their products reach enough of the population to become as iconic as the classics of past eras.

So that in establishing my list of post-1990 classics to present to the Chinese market, the popularity (and widespread availability) criterion effectively eliminated all of my personal favourites, except Féminité du Bois and N°5 Eau Première. It’s also forced me to list two scents I can’t stand, perhaps because their popularity means I’ve overdosed on them, Angel and L’Eau d’Issey. I struggled to include a Guerlain, and if Guet-Apens/Attrape-coeur had been more widely distributed (not to mention if it hadn’t been discontinued) it would have made the list in a flash. But the rest? You can’t say the house has been launched influential perfumes in the past 20 years. I also considered the overwhelmingly popular Dior J’Adore: it’s excellent, but original? Not so much.

The list is also fairly Franco-centric. That, of course, reflects my own bias: Estée Lauder Pleasures and Calvin Klein CKOne should have made the cut, the first because its pink pepper-peony-musk notes have been widely imitated, the second because it became a cultural phenomenon and pioneered the unisex trend. But since I was asked for ten selections… And for China, no less. Here they are, in chronological order:


Thierry Mugler Angel by Olivier Cresp (1992): The first gourmand, one of the most widely-imitated products in the industry, and one that still tops best-seller lists, at least in France, after nearly two decades.


Issey Miyake L’Eau d’Issey by Jacques Cavallier (1992): Not technically the first aquatic since Davidoff Cool Water (1988), Aramis New West For Him (1988) and For Her (1990) and Calvin Klein Escape (1991) pre-date it, but possibly the most iconic and, with Cool Water in the masculine side of the aisle, still going as strong as ever.


Serge Lutens, formerly Shiseido Féminité du Bois by Pierre Bourdon and Christopher Sheldrake (1992): Reintroduced the wood family for women, 70 years after Chanel’s Bois des Iles. Now that it’s been repatriated into the Serge Lutens brand, it’s moved out of the mainstream, but as the matrix of the Lutens style, which has had a strong influence on the industry, it makes the cut.


Bulgari Eau Parfumée au Thé Vert by Jean-Claude Ellena (1992): This groundbreaking composition reintroduced a genre that had lingered in the margins since Après l’Ondée: fragrances capturing an atmosphere rather than being an extension of a male or female persona. It was also one of the first expressions of a clear, limpid style at a time when perfumes were busy, heady, scenery-chewing things.


Lolita Lempicka by Annick Menardo (1997): As Luca Turin observed in The Guide, this may be the only one of Angel’s offspring to present enough originality not to be considered derivative. I would have rather included Menardo’s amazing Bulgari Black but much as I love it, it seems to be lingering on bottom shelves and possibly being phased out. So that it was a toss-up between Lolita Lempicka and another Menardo gem, Dior Hypnotic Poison, a flanker that defied expectations by actually gaining sales over the years even though it was no longer supported by advertising campaigns until recently.


Cartier Déclaration by Jean-Claude Ellena (1998): The template for a significant portion of the masculines that came after it. It vies with JCE’s Terre d’Hermès as the default choice of Frenchmen who find Guerlain Vétiver and Habit Rouge, Caron Pour un Homme and Dior Eau Sauvage a little too reminiscent of daddy.


Flower by Kenzo by Alberto Morillas (2000): The epitome of contemporary perfumery: a static, radiant, powdery haze that manages to convey both sensuality and innocence.


Narciso Rodriguez for Her by Christine Nagel and Francis Kurkdjian (2004): “Make it clean and sexy” must be the brief for 99 per cent of the feminine fragrances on the planet, and For Her scores high marks on both counts. Perhaps the best example of the “what you sniff when you spritz is what you get all day” contemporary school of perfumery, and of consistency between a brand and a fragrance product.


Dior Homme by Olivier Polge (2005): Olivier Polge dared to go where no masculine fragrance had gone before, by designing Dior Homme as a setting for the soft, powdery note of iris. One of those fragrances other perfumers regret they didn’t come up with. And, surefire sign of a classic: it’s filched by women.


Chanel N°5 Eau Première by Jacques Polge and Christopher Sheldrake (2008): I hesitated before including it since it’s still too recent to be a modern classic, but I couldn’t not put a Chanel in the list. I’m pretty sure Coco Mademoiselle is more popular, but I find it less distinctive and as one of the best examples of the reinterpretation of a classic done right, N°5 Eau Première rates high.


Now berate me, abuse me, say I’ve overlooked obvious choices…

What would be your list of the classics of the past 20 years?



Illustration: Brandt on Haffner by Bertrand Lavier, 1984.


47 commentaires:

  1. All those choices made sense to me, so no berating from my end!

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  2. You made a perfect list (didn't expect anything else from you!)When you think of best-selling and most popular Angel and l'eau d'Issey surely are the top 2 sellers of the past 2 decades. But if anyone please could come and get the stack of Angel samples that are constantly dumped in my shopping bag when I leave a perfumery, I would be very gratefull.. Perfect list Denyse! Nothing to add. Aaah... Flowerbomb by V&R as a very late Angel offspring perhaps?

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  3. Illdone, I'd say Flowerbomb is popular, but not terribly original? And, your samples of Angel remind me of an SA at the Galerie Lafayette who tried to spray me with the stuff saying "do you know this perfume?"
    I answered that I'd been smelling ten times a day for nearly 20 years, and that was just when I was paying attention... So, yeah, I kind of knew it...

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  4. Very true, Flowerbomb is yummie and warm-comforting but not very original.Most of the times when I'm in a "regular" perfume shop I put on my severe face and make hissing sounds (I must look like a complete nut sometimes) so as to be left alone. Most SA's don't know what they're talking about. But as this is completly off topic I'll leave the time and space for more or other suggestions for your list by others.

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  5. Carrying a cross and garlic is my option...

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  6. I know Eau Premiere is different enough from No. 5 to be rated on its own merits, and sure enough, it's a lovely, modern interpretation of the original. I wouldn't go as far as to declare it a classic though, it's too early days. Instead, I'd fill its slot with the more deserving Bulgari Black. Cool Water for men, although not exactly a favorite of mine, should be up there as well.
    The rest of your list is purrfect.

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  7. Ooops, I just realized that Cool Water was released in 1988 and as suc, doesn't qualify.

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  8. I love your paradigm. It does make for some shaking up of our internal lists, though, doesn't it?

    L'Eau d' Issey nails it as far as this goes. Every one of your marks, struck solid. Angel, Eau The Vert, Narcisco Rodrigues...all solid.

    Eau Premiere raises an interesting question...now that perfume is clearly accessible, and that it has entered the realm of fashion discussion in its own right, will it become appropriate to consider re-workings of original ideas? Or must we always stick to originality as a concept of something not yet experienced? Allowing it (which I am inclined to do for reasons I'll skip for now) creates a situation that allows Premiere to succeed on the third basis in an interesting way: it allowed a concept to cross over into our vocabulary that already was in our vocabulary (the original No. 5), but with fresh inflection...and perhaps gaining primacy for a new audience. Like a remake of a classic movie, when both receive critical acclaim.

    Hmmm...Feminite du Bois? I love it passionately. But...does it satisfy the popularity requirement? I wonder if looking at the numbers on, say, eBay sales of something like Donna Karan's Chaos or Black Cashmere might suggest one of those two actually reached more audience, and has crossed more widely into the social vocabulary.

    (I realize that might be perceived as a retort from this side of the ocean, but is in no way intended as such. I truly am wondering if perhaps, in order to play by the rules you have establish, FdB has to step off the podium and allow another innovative scent which better satisfies the requirements to step up. Interesting, in that we are talking the introduction of woods into the vocabulary regardless...)

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  9. Dusan, Bulgari Black is a classic in my heart. I truly do think it's one of the best things to come out in that period.
    But it's devilishly hard to find, and never caught on enormously, so that it only fulfills criterion N°1, alas.

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  10. Dusan: of course Cool Water is a classic! It just fell short of the dates, as you've seen. Those are always artificial (decades really start in the middle), but there you yo.

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  11. ScentScelf, you've nailed the two choices that are open to discussion.

    I'll defend my pick of Eau Première inasmuch as my first criterion included the possibility of a new reading of an older genre. I found it sufficiently new to give me an "oh my god that's so beautiful" shock the first time I smelled it. It think it inaugurates a "neo-aldehydic floral" family that could make a comeback (see NR Essence).

    Féminité du Bois has only recently gone from mainstream to niche and it has, indirectly, entered olfactory codes. The Donna Karans come later and I admit they never crossed my mind, but that may be because they're not available here to my knowledge.

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  12. This is a perfect selection, Denyse. I would have had a hard time choosing just ten fragrances and making an objective list.

    I miss Gucci Pour Homme (created by Michel Almairac in 2003), one of the best masculine fragrances out there, but it never was a best-seller, so I understand.

    Two missing best-sellers: Gaultier Le Male (1995) and D&G Light Blue (2001), this one has been imitated a thousand times.

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  13. Isa, both Le Mâle and Light Blue were in the list when it went up to 20: they are definitely classics, I agree. I also reluctantly abandoned the Mugler Cologne...

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  14. I'm rolling with Eau Première. (And forcing myself to find the diacriticals to show proper respect. :) ) I think allowing reinterpretation is a valid argument in art...and recognizing the effect of bringing a message/product to a new audience is worthy of a nod in both art and marketing.

    The issue of FdB vs Chaos or BC ... being a later in life entry in the perfumed realm, I'm still catching up on my history. However, I think I'm right in my understanding that FdB was never "mainstream" here in the United States...correct me please if I am wrong. FdB precedes the DK offerings historically, so influence within the field should be ceded to it on that basis. Still kind of worrying over the application of the third parameter, obviously.

    Which raises the question: How ARE you defining your sphere of influence, in terms of looking at who was the audience? It's certainly okay to focus the lens on French perfume (or any specific realm) if one is up front in saying where the boundaries are drawn. I'm assuming the magazine picked you to do this as you saw fit...AND that perhaps they expected a certain, um, leaning?

    Forgot to thank you before for letting us play with your assignment. And to wonder aloud that maybe Iso e-Super should get a special highlight box as part of the presentation?

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  15. Honestly, I think I'd swap out the Chanel for the Klein. From the American perspective, CKOne is so hugely influential as to be almost decade-defining, and I really don't think Eau Premiere is anywhere close to that. (Even though, IMHO, it is a far superior perfume.)

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  16. ScentScelf, ok, this isn't going into a book so, you know, it's not a list etched in marble!
    The Chinese magazine picked me because the chief editor of that issue knew me from the LCF, it's nothing to do with a French bias. But that's the market I know: I haven't live in North America for decades, and FdB precedes the blog explosion by more than ten years. Here it was very well known.
    1992 was a watershed year in perfumery and I listed the four most influential perfumes of that year for that reason: I think it really marks a turning point.

    And I did point out the Franco-centric bias in my paper: I think apart from Grojsman, innovation still came from the French branches of the big labs during that period.

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  17. Amy, if I do an additional list, just for the blog, I'll add CKOne though the originality of the juice itself is open to discussion...

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  18. How about Gucci Rush? Like S, I'm a little thrown off by the French-focus, because I don't know if it was popular in France, but it seems like it meets all the criteria from a NA standpoint.

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  19. i personnally would have included Coco Mademoiselle or Allure in the list (there are the only "main stream" recent scents i like) because as you say, Eau première is very recent with respect to the criteria you have set. i did not realise the Cartier parfum you cite was so popular, never really came across it unlike the ubiquitous Angel or Flower, or the J'adore for example

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  20. I tried to find fault (I mean, I REALLY tried)... but I think it's a perfect list. Maybe Pleasures instead of Chanel No. 5 Eau Première only because the latter is too early to tell... but you said that already. And, like Guerlain, it would have been nice to include an Estée Lauder perfume but you can't just add perfumes because of past glory (pre-1990).

    And, because I recommended Dior Homme to a friend recently, I felt validated when I saw it on your list.

    Lots of fun. It's the kind of task I run away from when asked about my top 5 or top 10. I admire you for tackling it head on!

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  21. denyse, i think your list is perfect! the only thing i'd do is indeed add coco mademoiselle, instead of eau premiere, as i consider it did spring many copies or similarly based fragrances. off the top of my head: viktor & rolf's flowerbomb, EDT version (a lighter coco m.), the 1st prada (a more ambery coco m.) and, more recently, van cleef & arpels' oriens...and i'm sure there are others i'm forgetting.

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  22. Erin, Gucci Rush totally meets my criteria and I actually own it, it's even included in my London College of Fashion curriculum, but weirdly, it didn't cross my mind.
    Though I'm not quite sure of how "fertile" it was. Not saying it wasn't, but can't think of any descendents.

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  23. Columbine, Déclaration by Cartier is a masculine so it's not competing with the others you mention. It's very big in France (I don't spend enough time in other countries to sniff the crowds abroad) and it's been hugely influential on the masculines.
    Coco Mademoiselle was under consideration but it doesn't strike me as terribly distinctive.

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  24. Normand, I wasn't looking for the best, or my favourites, but for classics. And Pleasures occurred to me "en après coup"... once the article was sent.

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  25. M, that's funny, I would have never linked the 1st Prada to Coco Mademoiselle: to me it's a chocolate-orange-amber-patch bomb. But the point is taken.

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  26. Pleasures' position in late-century perfumery is more about what it wasn't than what it was. And although I'll wear it from time to time, I'm not so sure about its potential for a classics list. Thanks for sharing your list, I'll refer to it the next time I decide to add to my collection.

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  27. Normand, I consider these references but as I said, they're not necessarily the things I wear or would recommend. Though I really love Déclaration and Dior Homme on a man.

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  28. Much as I hate to say it, you gotta have CKOne on a classics list. Of course, I don't think 20 years is long enough for a "classic" to establish itself, that's kind of funny, isn't it?? But that CKOne, when I was at university, that's all I smelled, I could not get away from THAT SMELL. And even if I could, a perfume sniper was sure to get me when I went out shopping! ACK!! And it was certainly a fertile creation, wasn't it? And of course, it really began the unisex trend in the public's mind, even though that trend had been around since Jicky, at least. And Americans sure do love their clean scents, even more so today, and that really began with the huge explosion of CKOne. Gack.
    -Marla

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  29. Marla, I guess I blocked out CK One because from the olfactory point of view it didn't bring much to the art: it was a pure marketing product. And probably subconsciously it rips out my ovaries to give recognition to anything Ann "I'm responsible for the fruities" Gottlieb conceived.
    But you're right, it's a modern classic as part of the social codes, and it's been copied a million times.

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  30. Fascinating reading, as always.

    If you don't mind my playing devil's advocate for a moment, I think the only real issue I have with your list is the popularity criterion. Perhaps it's simply a matter of semantics, but somehow, for me, the word 'popular' doesn't rest easily next to the word 'classic'. Mind you, I can see where you're coming from. After all, one wouldn't want an 'unpopular' scent to become a classic, right? But perhaps, instead of 'popular', I'd prefer 'well known' or 'widely recognised'. This would make room for the inclusion of scents which weren't necessarily commercial successes when they were released, but have since been recognised as important in the grand narrative of perfumery... scents like M7, for instance.

    And how about niche scents which weren't necessarily popular themselves but exercised considerable influence over mainstream producers?

    And what about the whole issue of niche? As far as I'm aware, many outlets of Sephora stock Serge Lutens... so does that not remove the line's niche label?

    Oh dear, I'd better stop, because I could go on and on.

    Having said all of the above, I think your list meets your own criteria admirably. I share your reservations about the inclusion of Eau Premiere, despite the fact that I love it and often wear it. And as for Guerlain, if Guet Apens is essentially Vol De Nuit Evasion, then I would've included it myself, but if you prefer a readily-available Guerlain, then what about L'Instant Pour Homme, or even Insolence.

    Okay, I'd better jump off my soapbox. Thanks for sparking some interesting thoughts :-)

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  31. Persolaise, points taken, but when you consider the perfumes of yesteryear that became classics (N°5, Shalimar, Fleurs de Rocaille, Joy, Fracas, Diorissimo, Eau Sauvage, etc.) you'll see they were also big commercial successes: this is what ensured their longevity, and longevity (potential in the case of the more recent scents I list) is one of the things that make a product become a classic.
    Popularity is also what ensure the trickle-down of the formula into functional fragrance: this is the point at which it enters the social codes. When it's in shampoo and deodorants. As I write, I have five products in my bathroom, including a purportedly unscented one, that reek of L'Eau d'Issey (they will not be repeat purchases).


    There could be a different definition of a classic that could be skewed in the direction of "seminal" or "influential", which would yield a different list.

    I excluded niche products because they don't reach a sufficient public, but included Féminité du Bois based on Serge Lutens' influence on the mainstream.

    As for Guerlain: Vol de Nuit Evasion, the edt version of Guet-Apens, is only available in duty-frees and thus not widely distributed and not being part of the normal line-up, could be discontinued any minute.
    Insolence was not trailblazing in the fruity floral register, so it didn't fit the first criterion.

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  32. Your primally expressive response to my advocacy of CKOne has left me rolling on the floor in stitches!
    -Marla

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  33. Just to say, as far as I'm concerned, I agree with the inclusion of Chanel No 5 Eau Premiere for the reasons you gave but also because I think Coco Mademoiselle owes more to Angel than it does the original Coco.....(I smell Coco Mad. all over the place in London and it drives me nuts.) Nicola

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  34. Nicola, true, Coco Mademoiselle does owe quite a lot to Angel, certainly much more than to Coco or to the chypres it's been attached to. I still maintain it's not original enough, but God, I smell it all the time too (usually: under-35, middle-management).

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  35. I have my own personal biases which cloud my judgment on lists such as this.... however, given your stated criteria, I would *never* have included Shiseido Feminite de Bois/Serge Lutens Feminite de Bois. I would remove FdB on account of popularity. It simply isn't popular. I can't imagine anyone ever having heard of FdB outside of our small little segment of perfume fanatics. If your definition of popularity is based on what people in France are wearing then let me tell you French folks are wearing very different perfumes than Americans. Shiseido Feminite de Bois was definitely not a household name here in the US. It has always been niche and I don't have the exact statistics but it's never been a gigantic seller either. If I were looking to include a "woody" fragrance for this list I would have considered DK Chaos or DK Black Cashmere which were household names in the US and, quite frankly, so much better than FdB.

    One perfumer who should be on this list is Dominique Ropion and I think he makes it with Amarige. Amarige has been at the top of the bestseller lists since the early 90's. It still is. It was original at the time, however, it has not created any copycats (such as Angel and a few others you mention). In fact, the trend for big florientals has vanished so perhaps Amarige doesn't quite make the cut, but I think it deserves honorable mention ;-)

    Oh, and including Chanel Eau Premiere in this list? NO WAY. It's a nice flanker but it's certainly not within the top 10 of the past 20 years. I hereby give you permission to exclude Chanel from the list if you can't think of one :) Plopping Eau Premiere on this list just seems weird to me.

    I write all this in good spirit. I know sometimes comments might seem rude when you don't personally know the individual posting. You gave us the opportunity to critique your list and so I have...

    Although, I pretty much agree with all the others on your list. As much as I despise flimsy little aquatics like L'eau d'Issey it certainly deserves to be on this list. And Angel absolutely does.

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  36. I just thought of the perfume I personally would include instead of Chanel Eau Premiere. I would include Dior J'Adore in place of Eau Premiere.
    J'Adore is enormously popular (in the US) and it was unique enough when launched and has remained the "one to follow" for quite sometime now.
    Now, do I like and wear J'Adore myself? No, not at all, I find it screechy, but it seems to meet your criteria.

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  37. Abigail, no issue taken at all! Lists are always subject to bias, and the artificial limit of 10 means there are glaring omissions. I wanted to give the Chinese readers of the magazine as wide a scope of styles as possible.

    I would maintain FdB because it was part of the "seminal four" that shifted the paradigms of perfumery in 1992. It's been a long time and I don't have stats, but as far as I recall, it was quite well-known in France in the 90s. I know France isn't the center of the world, but it's still pretty much the hub of the perfume world -- take any top ten sellers list in any country and you'll see French perfumers are behind at least half of them, even if they're working in the US. I've done the exercise. So that something that was big in France would have a disproportionate influence. Donna Karan isn't big here because she's not sold here, unfortunately, so I can't compare the merits of Chaos or Black Cashmere with those of FdB -- they're even hard to find in Canada so I haven't smelled them that often.

    Point taken on Amarige: I think Ropion is one of the greatest perfumers of his time. I think the name dropped off from an original list of about 25 because I perceived it to be more in the language of the 80s, like Trésor.

    I wouldn't fight to the death on Eau Première, especially since it's so recent. I considered J'Adore, which is indeed extraordinarily popular internationally, and very copied, and culled it from the final 10 a little unfairly because there was already a better Dior on it and I think LVMH is the antichrist.
    Mind you, I'm not wild about what Chanel has been doing of late.

    But a top 20 list would definitely have to include Trésor, Amarige and J'Adore.

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  38. So many clever comments, but I must add one. For a Guerlain - we must have a Guerlain! - maybe l'Instant. I smell it quite often in the US, where I'm from, in France, where my husband is from, and here in Germany, where I live. I would remove Chanel Eau Premiere and replace with CKOne or Pleasures. In fact, I think both CKOne and Pleasures have to be on the list (maybe not in France, admitted), so I might also remove Lolita Lempicka because it is a derivative. (As an aside, I can't believe how many genius perfumes Menardo created in the space of about one year - LL, HP, Black!)

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  39. Carla, I could easily do almost half a top ten just with Menardo! I don't consider Lolita Lempicka derivative, however: no more than you'd say Arpège is derivative of N°5. It is its own creature and its ancestor is as much L'Heure Bleue as it is Angel.

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  40. Very provocative, Denyse! Your rules are both ingeniously perfect and devilishly difficult - as they'd have to be in order to narrow the offerings of the most prolific decades in perfume history down to ten.

    Just for fun, I'd like to nominate the Demeter line, which predates Aqua Allegoria and CdG, I believe. I think these are pretty popular, and that idea of novel notes transformed into perfume has been hugely influential. And although I really want to nominate the whole Library, if I have to choose one classic scent, the archetypal one for me is Tomato - I will always remember the shock of pleasure the first time I tried it at Sephora, and I still love it.

    I admit it is entirely possible that I'm giving Demeter too much credit based on my limited knowledge and experience, and I'll certainly defer to the French perspective, since that is where the great noses are! ~~nozknoz

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  41. Nozknoz, thanks for reminding me of Demeter. They're not on my radar because I'm not quite sure if they're even distributed in France, but I've just added a new bit in my book on them!

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  42. Won't add anything... Just enjoy in your comments and try to find mentioned perfumes that I haven't tried yet. :)

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  43. A consideration: to my perception L'Eau d'Issey is rather a landmark than a classic; it's effect is outworn and I doubt will be revisited. Certainly it would belong in any 90ties top ten list. Lolita Lempicka seems somewhat redundant because Angel covers the genre and I am missing Gucci Rush and Envy (I am not sure if fertility is necessarily a criteria- the two express the era perfectly and have the quality to live on and still speak up until today, what makes them classics in my eyes), and a Comme des Garcons, I guess CDG 2.
    Very much agree on Feminite du Bois.

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  44. Cybele, those are all good points, but on Lolita, I'm with Luca Turin in considering it's different enough from Angel not to be a twist. I still maintain fecundity is an essential criterion and from that standpoint, perhaps New West would have been a better pick than L'Eau d'Issey, but the latter is more iconic, more copied and still widely worn. The thing is that as accords because over-abused you end up smelling nothing *but* those accords, not the originality of them.
    I agree both Guccis have classic status - but the list was restricted to 10. The CdG have only been marginally influental, and the two first were not necessarily ground-breaking forms according to the professionals I've discussed this with.
    In fact, the consensus among many is that only 2 groundbreaking forms were created over that period, Angel and Féminité du Bois.

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  45. interesting about the Comme des Garcons, I had perceived them as more influential- also for inst., the Incense line as a whole- certainly not commercial wise, though. Thanks for your answer even though I am coming in so late and for your great blog!

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  46. Cybele, even their own artistic director doesn't consider that they had a huge impact, at least not on the mainstream market, though I had considered the Incense Series in the long list.

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