tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post1374169702195083338..comments2024-03-29T09:11:58.393+01:00Comments on Grain de musc: Thoughts on the death of chypre and Amouage Jubilation 25carmencanada /Grain de Muschttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comBlogger45125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-62613630611726884582020-03-13T17:52:02.165+01:002020-03-13T17:52:02.165+01:00Hello, an amazing Information dude. Thanks for sha...Hello, an amazing Information dude. Thanks for sharing this nice information with us. <a href="https://www.maisondeparfum.shop/collections/all/creed" rel="nofollow">Creed perfume</a>Micheal Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05475927639200371365noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-34458071853228306262010-03-18T23:38:44.929+01:002010-03-18T23:38:44.929+01:00carmencanada, in that sense I totally agree with y...carmencanada, in that sense I totally agree with you.Uellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00470633955030465849noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-77175176172315852642010-03-18T23:10:39.424+01:002010-03-18T23:10:39.424+01:00Uella, I still thinks it's a denial of the fem...Uella, I still thinks it's a denial of the feminine, in the sense of womanhood as opposed to girlishness. And a form of spaying, as it were.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-23655523209269341522010-03-18T22:56:34.745+01:002010-03-18T22:56:34.745+01:00I don't think it's de-femininization but m...I don't think it's de-femininization but more the sexist standards of femininity: young, fresh, sexy, slim, attractive...actually most of those adjectives were used by Thierry Wasser himself to introduce Idylle. <br /><br />Women feel they have to smell good yet unobtrusive and please men, the response to that is pale and thin fruity-florals and other unimaginative and dreary stuff that has been launched for a while now. <br />Chypres were still good for the women of the '80s who strive for power until she realised 20 years later that a fat wallet doesn't give her a man, youth and a hot body with half a brain does!Uellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00470633955030465849noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-88466974582283644102010-03-18T22:55:07.249+01:002010-03-18T22:55:07.249+01:00Ce commentaire a été supprimé par l'auteur.Uellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00470633955030465849noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-20679430656463589742010-03-18T07:28:04.382+01:002010-03-18T07:28:04.382+01:00Uella, I've been thinking about this trend for...Uella, I've been thinking about this trend for de-materialization and de-femininization: flesh and colour taken out until all that subsists is the garishness of the digital image. Ce sont les parfums "excusez-moi d'exister".carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-33222581004724871872010-03-18T04:26:10.095+01:002010-03-18T04:26:10.095+01:00Chypres but also heady florals and orientals are a...Chypres but also heady florals and orientals are a thing of the past! <br />Nobody markets sophisticated perfumes to women that express and exude personality, class and character. Perfumery has become anemic and anorexic. And that goes beyond perfumery; in the US, the huge success of neutral beige lipsticks triggered a marketing explosion of all those "barely there" and "less is more" makeup brands and concepts. The "talibans" of fashion (who happen to be older female execs actually!) only use underage covergirls who are marketed to women all around world as an ideology or an image of who they're supposed to be like with this notion that women can only be happy if they're the size of a pencil or thin as a rail. What is the real ideology behind that - girls and women starving themselves? It's about disappearing. It's as if you become less and less, you actually won't exist eventually. You won't take up space. You won’t have power.Uellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00470633955030465849noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-25956840352792448172010-03-17T00:13:44.038+01:002010-03-17T00:13:44.038+01:00Dante's Bra: listening to the music's clue...Dante's Bra: listening to the music's clues to dance -- it does indeed require much more focus, culture and sense of nuance. You're right, it's the same thing with certain types of fragrances: they require a musical ear and a certain culture.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-77839866111637269222010-03-16T23:22:44.809+01:002010-03-16T23:22:44.809+01:00I've been chewing on this post for the past we...I've been chewing on this post for the past week; art, history and desire/senses is a bit melancholy, but provocative. <br /><br />I've been organizing some some cuban danzon classes by my favorite dance teacher, and it makes me think of similar issues around lost or dying art forms. Few people have the patience or interest in culture and history to really enjoy his classes. Danzon is so much slower and more subtle than salsa, and the heart of it was listening to the music cues as well as the intimacy of dancing close with someone. <br /><br />I want there to always be chypres because it expands our notions of what is beautiful. Not nostalgia, just wanting the vocabulary to be as expansive as possible!Dante's Brahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17419426789770980961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-74824788305722071522010-03-16T08:56:22.046+01:002010-03-16T08:56:22.046+01:00Flora, fortunately it is also a world that allows ...Flora, fortunately it is also a world that allows us the possibility of creating parallel worlds, where J25 can still come out and be appreciated.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-6956356772488498282010-03-16T06:10:17.114+01:002010-03-16T06:10:17.114+01:00Wonderful piece, Denyse! Your writing is always im...Wonderful piece, Denyse! Your writing is always imbued with such great intelligence and insight.<br /><br />I just refuse to believe that something so wonderful as the true Chypre genre of perfumery can just be allowed to die. I can only hope that IFRA will back off someday soon and that the perfumers of the world will rebel if they are pushed too hard. I will keep collecting the best chypres I can find, at least enough to last me however long I have left in this world. When I think that a masterpiece like Houbigant Essence Rare is gone forever but apparently any perfume with Britney Spears' name on it can be a commercial success, that's not a world I want to live in.Florahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00510346346502906435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-76197248210397432542010-03-15T09:35:04.852+01:002010-03-15T09:35:04.852+01:00Anonymous: I guess you could say that it's a v...Anonymous: I guess you could say that it's a very niche section of the market, compared to the millions of people who buy the latest X or Y.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-35649122615308823812010-03-15T03:17:48.585+01:002010-03-15T03:17:48.585+01:00Except for the "clientele" who hunt down...Except for the "clientele" who hunt down old fragrances...?Anwyay,<br />now I know why my old bottles of Ysatis are hidden away in my sock drawer! Merci, encore.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-82894472321471839612010-03-14T19:41:36.814+01:002010-03-14T19:41:36.814+01:00Anonymous, so many things have been labeled chypre...Anonymous, so many things have been labeled chypre recently... One wonders why, since it can't possibly resonate with today's clientele. I'm glad the post cleared up a few points for you!carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-37461876632314113692010-03-14T16:57:33.213+01:002010-03-14T16:57:33.213+01:00So interesting...I'm a magazine beauty editor ...So interesting...I'm a magazine beauty editor and was told that Guerlain Idylle is a chypre blend. But an impartial perfume expert told me --"it's not a REAL chypre"--and I didn't get her comment until I read your very illuminating piece, and the state of oakmoss. <br /> My fragrant "history" is redolent with TRUE chypres --la vrai chose.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-50686118490476092212010-03-13T23:03:10.820+01:002010-03-13T23:03:10.820+01:00Nozknoz, I'm not complaining: there are a lot ...Nozknoz, I'm not complaining: there are a lot of things I've loved these past months, and I'm not the nostalgic type!carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-31949930827898366352010-03-13T22:13:39.897+01:002010-03-13T22:13:39.897+01:00"Business English" - you are SO right (a..."Business English" - you are SO right (as always)! At the same time, there are a lot of new and different things to enjoy. CdG Monocle Laurel and Killian's Pure Oud recently are examples of scents I've sniffed recently that really tickle my nose, speaking figuratively. Sometimes I think it's like music: we may not have a Mozart or Bach, but we've got jazz, world music, hip hop - too many to name. Less depth and richness, perhaps, but a much wider range. We're inhabiting a kaleidoscope rather than a palace.... --nozknozAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-12196475072571638952010-03-13T08:39:23.373+01:002010-03-13T08:39:23.373+01:00Nozknoz, I don't know how many living language...Nozknoz, I don't know how many living languages are disappearing from the face of the Earth as we speak, but apparently the death rate is appalling. Current mainstream perfumery is the equivalent of business English. Expect perfumery "Engrish" to appear any time soon.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-70225670472266651382010-03-13T08:36:13.448+01:002010-03-13T08:36:13.448+01:00Nathan, if I wanted to go all Borges on you or som...Nathan, if I wanted to go all Borges on you or something, I'd say that if the Japanese stopped collectively believing in us, we might disappear. I mean vanish, poof! You see them at shows, and they've got the faith. Those looks! No irony. We survive with irony.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-684775390354403032010-03-13T05:42:38.401+01:002010-03-13T05:42:38.401+01:00Oh, dear, I'm feeling a bit like an elderly cr...Oh, dear, I'm feeling a bit like an elderly crone, the last speaker of the language of one of those tiny, dwindling tribes whose young people spend all their time watching MTV! At least the privilege of knowing that language compensates some of the losses of age. I always love your choice of artwork, Denyse, and this time you outdid even yourself! --nozknozAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-37290685583975964012010-03-13T03:24:54.260+01:002010-03-13T03:24:54.260+01:00"much in the way that the Japanese are the la..."much in the way that the Japanese are the last who truly believe in fashion, as anyone who attends the Paris fashion week can observe."<br /><br />*giggle*Nathan Branchhttp://www.nathanbranch.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-69939893247298683312010-03-12T23:47:51.927+01:002010-03-12T23:47:51.927+01:00Alyssa, I think you could absolutely have the same...Alyssa, I think you could absolutely have the same line of reasoning about Perfume with a capital P. But other families are still thriving (orientals, fougères, even aldehydic florals are enjoying a revival). Chypre is more symptomatic it seems.<br />I am now following a different train of thought while reading an essay about fashion and modernity (the timeline starts with Baudelaire), about the way fashion constantly leaps accross timelines to periods past, while never repeating itself. I think this could be applied to the various forms/families/templates of perfume. But it's a big book and the thoughts might take some time to formulate.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-18906182376747176282010-03-12T23:09:18.596+01:002010-03-12T23:09:18.596+01:00Hmmm.
An interesting train of thought. I agree, ...Hmmm. <br /><br />An interesting train of thought. I agree, for the most part.<br /><br />I wonder if you could, without pushing too hard, say the same thing about Perfume, with a capital P, "proper perfume," "classical perfume" in general. All is awash in nostalgia and mythology, the original of everything has been lost, and so on and so forth. If there ever was an original in the first place... <br /><br />Of course, you are saying something subtler and more specific here. And there is always more hope in specificities, and in the concrete, I think. I am one of those resistant to spectrality, I suppose, in spite of the amount of time I spend on the internet.Alyssahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08651065872724626149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-59589350763583243542010-03-12T09:33:16.051+01:002010-03-12T09:33:16.051+01:00Rappleyea, I haven't tried all the Amouage, bu...Rappleyea, I haven't tried all the Amouage, but I can tease out a material in a couple of them that I call the "spiky wood" which is indeed something that bothers me. For instance, the man Jubilation has it in spades and I'm hyperosmic to it, so I can't wear it, despite it being by dear Bertrand D.carmencanada /Grain de Muschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04046101625425953248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4922907157797061660.post-21572256560414739972010-03-12T02:40:52.620+01:002010-03-12T02:40:52.620+01:00Is it too late to sign up for the march?
I've...Is it too late to sign up for the march?<br /><br />I've loved chypres since wearing Mitsouko in high school, long before I'd ever heard the term. It's mate on the Guerlain counter, Shalimar, was just too sweet for me. Femme, Diorella and the original Givenchy III were also favorites. <br /><br />Alas, something in the very beautiful Amouage scents gives me a headache - the only line that has ever happened with. <br /><br />Beautiful post, especially your rather profound last line.Rappleyeahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05368969125735482669noreply@blogger.com